[INTRODUCTION]

Hal Elrod: What would you do if a doctor told you that you had cancer and that chemotherapy was your only option, although it could kill you? Would you just say yes? My guest today, Chris Wark, was 26 years old, newly married, and just getting his footing in life when he was diagnosed with stage 3 colon cancer. And when his doctors pushed chemo, he did something that scared everyone around him. He said no. Instead, he radically transformed his diet, his mindset, and his relationship with God. And over 20 years later, he is still here, cancer-free, and he’s helped millions of people do the same, including me.

Now, I need to be honest with you, I’m not unbiased when it comes to Chris. When I was diagnosed with a rare, aggressive form of cancer with a 20% to 30% survival rate, Chris’s website, ChrisBeatCancer.com, was the single most important resource I turned to. I genuinely believe it’s part of the reason that I am still here with you today. And in this conversation, we get into what cancer, the industry, doesn’t want you asking your doctor, the diet and lifestyle changes that could prevent cancer in the first place, and the one emotional practice Chris believes is as powerful as any medicine. And I share exactly what I did to beat cancer against those odds. So, make sure you stay until the end.

Whether you or someone you love is facing cancer right now, or you simply don’t want to, this episode could change your life. Let’s go.

[INTERVIEW]

Hal Elrod: Chris Wark, it’s so good to be with you, brother.

Chris Wark: It’s great to be with you. Great to see you in person. You look well. You look great. You look really good.

Hal Elrod: Yeah. The last time I talked to you, I believe I had just been diagnosed with cancer, and I don’t know if I just reached out to your website or someone connected us, but I found ChrisBeatCancer.com. And as I was telling you before we started recording, like that is literally 100% of the people that I get connected with who have cancer, whether my aunt has cancer right now, a team member has cancer, and just people reach out to me a lot and go, “Hey, Hal, my cousin has cancer. Would you mind talking with them?” And I think it’s 100% of the time that I lead them to ChrisBeatCancer.com, which was the resource where I really got all of the holistic guidance from you, as well as a lot of the spiritual guidance, if you will, to overcome cancer. Man, so I owe you such a huge debt of gratitude.

Chris Wark: That’s awesome. I mean, I created that website to be what I wished had existed for me when I was diagnosed in December 2003. And seven years later, I started ChrisBeatCancer.com. But yeah, that was the mission. It’s like, man, and even at that time now, there’s a million websites and social media pages and people talking about cancer, and it’s a whole different world. But even in 2010, there really wasn’t much information online about with evidence-based information on nutrition and natural, non-toxic therapies, holistic approaches to cancer, integrative approaches, there just wasn’t much out there online.

And I was like, man, like I had learned so much that I was like, “I need to try to organize this and just bring it to people that are looking and share my story, and hopefully, I can be encouraging and bring some hope and some guidance. Yeah, it ballooned into something I did not expect. It was a part-time passion that turned into my profession. And after doing it for about five years, it just kind of blew up. And so, yeah, here we are. And I wonder, do you know JP Moses?

Hal Elrod: I don’t.

Chris Wark: Alright. Well, I’ve got a buddy named JP and I think he was the guy, I think he told me about your book, Miracle Morning, years ago. And he said, “This is a great book. You should read it, get a copy of it.” I got a copy of it and I was reading it and it was like, “Oh man, this guy sold Cutco. That’s amazing. I sold Cutco too for two and a half years in college.” And I’m like, “Oh, how about that?” And so, yeah, read the book, and then I don’t remember how we got in touch, but yeah, somebody, you reached out or somehow we got connected, and I knew who you were already and was just like, “Yeah, man, let’s talk.” And so, when was that? Six, seven years ago?

Hal Elrod: Nine years ago, man. So, I was diagnosed in October 2019, so it’ll be 10 years, or I’m sorry, 2016, so it’ll be 10 years this October. So, yeah, it’s about nine and a half years ago that I was diagnosed. And you and I probably connected right around nine years ago. So, yeah, dude, time flies.

Chris Wark: That’s amazing. Man, you’re coming up on a 10-year cancerversary. That’s really awesome.

Hal Elrod: Yeah. Yeah.

Chris Wark: That’s a milestone.

Hal Elrod: And for me…

Chris Wark: And I remember our conversation because I was walking around my front yard on the phone talking to you at my previous house with my shoes off because I’m grounding.

Hal Elrod: Grounding. Yeah.

Chris Wark: Yeah, but I remember that conver… I mean, I don’t remember everything that was said, but I remember being on the phone with you, being in my front yard, walking around.

Hal Elrod: That is cool. So, what I’d like to do today is I want you to share your story. I really would love to start there, but before you do, just kind of where I’d like to take us, for anyone that’s watching this who has cancer or in their world, right, where again, aunt, uncle, grandparent, father, mother, anybody that in your world has cancer, and anyone listening who is like, “I don’t want to get cancer,” the statistics are saying it’s like 50% give or take that I’m going to get cancer based on all of the toxins in our environment and our food and all of these things. So, it’s like, how do we prevent cancer? And, by the way, I didn’t know you had that book. I’m looking over your shoulder, Beat Cancer Daily. Am I right in imagining that’s like a cancer prevention type of book?

Chris Wark: It’s actually like a daily devotional. Yeah. It’s a daily devotional, daily reader. So, it’s 365 days of inspiration, encouragement, and action steps to survive and thrive. So, that’s the subtitle. So, it isn’t just for cancer patients, actually, but it’s a mix of scripture, encouraging scripture, and then practical life advice, and just encouraging information, and anecdotes and stories and quotes, and just stuff I’d collected that I was like, “Man, I love all this. I want to share it,” all these little just nuggets. And so, that book came about, and the cookbook, Beat Cancer Kitchen, those came about during, yeah, the pandemic 2020-2021. We just cranked them out. I was kind of stuck at home, and like I had those ideas percolating. It’s like, “All right, let’s do it.”

Hal Elrod: Let’s do it. Because that’s a big thing for me, like I live and you can call it an anti-cancer lifestyle now, but it’s the idea, especially early on after cancer, my cancer has a very high relapse rate, right? So, it’s like your cancer could come back, and if it comes back, it’s even worse than the first time. And so, I really went from, before I had cancer, I identified as healthy. And I think this is an important paradigm for people listening. Like, if you would’ve said, “Are you healthy?” I’d go, “I’m healthier than like 90% of people.” But that’s a terrible way to check your own standards. Like, you can look at the lowest common denominator and go, “I’m doing better than most, right? I only get drunk four days a week. My friend gets drunk seven days a week, so I’m way better.”

And that was kind of my mindset, like, “I only have vegan ice cream, I only blankety-blankety-blank. I don’t drink alcohol that often.” And now it’s impeccable. Like for me, it’s like I don’t want to put anything in my body that could cause cancer. And it’s not 100%, but it’s very close, right? Meaning, it’s not that I won’t eat a thing or do a thing. So, anyway, all of that said, I’d love to talk about your story. I’d love to talk about where anyone that has cancer, what resources, what mindset, how you’d recommend approaching it. We can kind of go back and forth on that. And I’d love to at some point talk about the cancer industry, if you’re okay going down that road. And just the medical industry, and the cancer industry, and the profit motive.

And then I’d love to talk about how to live a cancer-free lifestyle so that someone that doesn’t have cancer or had it and doesn’t want to get it again, what can you do each day? What can you put in your body and not put in your body to minimize the chances that you would get cancer and maximize the chance that you’re going to have a long, healthy life? Does that sound like a good kind of roadmap for us to follow?

Chris Wark: Yeah. And I think I can squeeze all that in, in about four hours. No, for sure, for sure. Yeah, we can do it.

Hal Elrod: Love it. Alright, man. Yeah, share your story. So, 2003 was the diagnosis, correct?

Chris Wark: Yeah. I was having abdominal pain. I was 26 and the pain, at first, I mean, you have little pains here and there, and you say, “Oh, I don’t know,” and they go away. But this pain persisted, and it just kind of kept bothering me for the better part of a year. Eventually, I went in and had, after multiple doctor’s appointments, I eventually had a colonoscopy, and they found a golf ball-sized tumor in my colon, and biopsied it, and said, “You’ve got colon cancer.” You know, it’s like just the worst news ever, right, especially for a young person, as you understand.

Hal Elrod: Yeah.

Chris Wark: I mean, 26, I’d been married two years. I was in real estate at the time, and like I mean, I was just getting going, right? I was like, just getting some traction as a young adult, grown up, and like out in the world. And then I got hit with this major blow. And as a believer, it shakes your faith, right? Adversity, trials, difficulties really shake your faith. And especially if you have sort of like an infant type faith, which I’m going to say I did.

Hal Elrod: Yeah.

Chris Wark: Because I’d never had any adversity in my life. I mean, everybody has little problems and stuff, but I’d never had real adversity. And my parents didn’t get divorced. I mean, like I had a very good upbringing, very solid, never had to worry about anything other than just normal insecurities that young people have and fitting in and whatever, just passing a test, that kind of stuff. And so, now I was like, man, like why is this happening to me, this feels so unfair. Like, why? I was going to church. I was playing on the worship team. I’m serving in the church. I’m making decisions. I’m not chasing after worldly things. You know what I’m saying?

As many of my friends were doing, right, drinking and doing drugs and going to strip clubs, and just like doing all this stuff, I’m like, “Man, I’m not doing any of that. Like, I’ve turned away, like I’m not doing those things. I’m really trying to follow Jesus,” and here now I got cancer, right? Meanwhile, there are just horrible people. And I’m not talking about my friends. I’m talking about, actually, super bad people running around the city of Memphis, which is like one of the most dangerous cities in the US, like full of criminals in great health.

Hal Elrod: Yeah. They’re like harming people and like robbing people.

Chris Wark: Robbing, stealing, raping, you know what I’m saying? Like, all these bad guys out there, and like, “Why did I get cancer?”

Hal Elrod: Yeah.

Chris Wark: So, I think everybody feels some sense of injustice and feels like it’s unfair, and they question it. And there’s this beautiful verse in the Bible that says, “Trust in the Lord with all your heart and lean not on your own understanding. In all your ways, acknowledge Him, and he will make your path straight.” And, yeah, like I’d heard that verse lots of times. It’s like, yeah, okay, that seems good. But that verse is about hardship. That’s about hardship. It’s not about life’s great. That’s not when you need that verse, right? That’s not when you need that promise. You need that promise when you are in the middle of hardship because it says, “Trust in the Lord with all your heart and not in your own understanding,” because you’re going to be in a situation that you don’t understand why it’s happening, right?

Like, you’re just like, “God, I don’t understand this. I don’t deserve this. This is so unfair. This is terrible.” Whatever the news is, and we all have those situations in life. And so, the command is just trust in the Lord, right? And so, trust Him with all your heart, even though you don’t understand, and all your ways acknowledge him. And that’s a little bit nebulous, but what I believe it means is kind of stepping back and just saying, “You know what, God, you are the creator of everything. You’ve created the earth. It all belongs to you. Like everything I have belongs to you. You’ve blessed me in so many ways, and I want to live a life that’s pleasing to you, and everything I do, I want you to be pleased.”

And so, like, orienting yourself to trust in Him, and live your life in a way that’s pleasing to God, and he will make your path straight. That’s the promise, right? So, there’s like a command with a promise attached. And Him making your path straight, that’s what you want. You want the straight path, right? The straight path. That’s the fastest way to get from point A to point B. You don’t want the crooked path, you don’t want the wild goose chase, right? You don’t want to run around in circles. You want the straight path. And for me, it was like the straight path to health, to healing, to restoration, right? That’s what I want, like the fastest way to get out of this mess.

And so, it forced me to just say, “God, I trust you. I trust you with my life and my health and my family and my future. And I don’t understand this, but I trust you anyway. Like I’m going to trust you to lead me through it.” That wasn’t the first verse by the way that came to mind. The first verse that came to mind was Romans 8:28, which perfectly aligns with this, which is Romans 8:28 says, “We know that God works all things for the good of those who love him and who were called according to His purpose.” And Paul wrote that after he had been beaten to death, imprisoned, shipwrecked, like had just tremendous amounts of suffering. And he writes, “We know that God works all things for the good of those who love him.”

So, that was the first verse that came to mind and I thought, “Oh man, this is a challenge right there. God, how is he going to work this for my good, right? This stinks.” But, again, that was the faith test. It’s like God saying, “Are you going to believe? Are you going to believe? Do you believe my word is true? Do you believe I’m going to work this for your good or not?” And so, I was like, “Okay, I’m going to believe it. I’m going to believe you’re going to work this for my good.”

Hal Elrod: So, faith was really your foundation in this extremely difficult time in your life, and trying to figure out what you were going to do, right?

Chris Wark: Yeah, absolutely. From day one, man, and I don’t want to sound like I’m some super faith warrior because I was not, okay? But I was desperately clinging to just a few scriptures, like promises of God in desperation, not in like superhero confidence. So, there’s a big difference. I want to make sure everybody understands, like, yeah, that I was not as, anyway, so I was encouraged by the promises of God. I trusted him to lead me. I had surgery. I was kind of rushed into surgery, and we can get into the cancer industry and how they treat patients, but I was rushed in, and before I really knew what was happening to me, and had surgery on December 30th, they took out a third of my colon.

When I woke up, they said, “You’re stage 3, which is worse than we thought. So, you’re going to need chemotherapy.” And that was another blow because all of a sudden, now it’s, “Oh, it’s even worse.” Initially, it was like, “Well, you just need surgery, and then you’ll be fine.” And now it’s like, “Oh no, full-fledged cancer patient with the chemo.” And I had seen what chemo does to people, and just not anyone close to me, but just people in the world, right? And I knew how, like, really harsh and difficult and toxic, and there’s a lot of suffering that goes alongside certain chemotherapy drugs. They can be deadly in some cases. And so, I had a resistance to that.

I didn’t have peace about it for me, and I didn’t really know why, but I just didn’t have peace about it. I had a very strong internal resistance to it. And when I got out of the hospital, and I started to sober up and really think about my life and my future, I just thought, “Man, I don’t know if this is the path for me, but I don’t know what else to do.” So, I was like, my wife and I prayed about it, and I just said, “God, if there’s another way besides chemotherapy, please show me. I trust you, but I don’t have peace about this.” And two days later, I got a book that was sent to me from a man in Alaska who knew my dad. And that was this old book called God’s Way to Ultimate Health by George Malkmus.

Hal Elrod: Wow.

Chris Wark: And George… Do you know it?

Hal Elrod: No, but I mean just going off the title and your prayer and the timing.

Chris Wark: Yeah. So, this book is called God’s Way to Ultimate Health, and the subtitle was like a Common Sense Guide to Eliminating Sickness through Nutrition. So, I’m like, “Okay, what’s this about?” I crack it open. I start reading George’s story, and he was diagnosed with colon cancer, and long story short, he was able to heal himself without surgery or chemo or anything by changing his diet to a diet that was predominantly raw, organic, fruits and vegetables, lots of fresh juices, carrot juice especially. And as I’m reading his story, man, I was just overwhelmed. I was like, “I can’t believe this showed up. This is an answer to my prayer.” I prayed, and this showed up. I just know, right? I know this is the answer.

I asked for something, and this showed up. This is it. So, overnight, I was like, “I’m doing it. I’m doing it.” Went to Whole Foods, loaded up the cart, got a bunch of vegetables, bought a juicer, did some wheatgrass shots while I was there, back when Whole Foods actually made juices in the store. Most people may not remember that. They used to sell juicers and everything at Whole Foods. But it was just an immediate conversion for me, and I was really excited. When you pray, and you get an answer to your prayer, and you know you’ve got an answer, it’s so exciting. It’s like overwhelming. I mean, I had tears of joy coming down my face as I was reading this guy’s story, because I knew that I just felt the love and the provision of God.

Hal Elrod: Yeah. It strengthens your faith, right, when you pray and something so blatantly. I’ve had things like that where you pray for something that’s so blatant and so immediate, or you go like that, it can’t be coincidence in the way that it rolled out. So, yeah. Go ahead.

Chris Wark: Yeah. I just knew it wasn’t. There was no doubt. I had no doubt. I have doubts about other things, but no doubt at that time. And so, I kind of got off, got going, had some resistance from family members. All the fun, all the little details are in my first book, it’s called Chris Beat Cancer, but I’m trying to, for the sake of time, kind of hit some of the highlights. But I had resistance from friends and family, and that was really hard, especially when you feel like you’ve prayed and God’s given you a direction to go, and then everyone else says, “No, don’t go that way. That’s a mistake.”

Hal Elrod: Yeah. Out of fear, especially, it’s often if you don’t do the thing that the only thing that we’ve been told by institutions works, you’re in trouble, right?

Chris Wark: Yeah. And that’s really hard because I’m like, “Well, hang on a second. I’ve been praying, and I feel like the Lord’s leading me. Are you also praying, and is he telling you this is wrong for me, or is this just your opinion?”

Hal Elrod: Are you watching the news? Yes.

Chris Wark: Right. And so, again, these are people that care about me, so I don’t falter for it.

Hal Elrod: Sure. Of course.

Chris Wark: They were operating from a fear-based mentality, and they all just sort of believed like, “Well, you just have to do what the doctor says. You just have to do what they say.” And I was fortunate, and I’m really blessed just to say that my mom was very natural, holistically minded, and had a huge collection of books on juicing and raw foods and healing and alternative cancer therapies. Like, she just had all these books. Like, she had read and collected. She’s a voracious reader, had always loved just the natural health world, even though she wasn’t like a strict vegan or vegetarian or anything like that. And so, she had a lot of just stacks and stacks of books from the 70s and 80s and 90s on health and healing.

And so, I started to read those. I just went from book to book to book. And what I found, I just kept finding the same answer, which is kind of funny because it’s like God gave me an answer, but I kept looking. I kept looking for more answers, more confirmation. And I kept getting the same answer: raw food, juicing, fasting, exercise, forgiveness, right? Like, these are the common threads in every holistic cancer survival story. You just see it over and over again, this comprehensive approach to healing. It’s body, mind, and spirit. And so, what I call the beat cancer mindset, it starts with a very simple thing. You have to believe. You must believe that healing is possible.

That’s where it all starts. You have to believe healing is possible. You don’t have to be positive you’re going to get well, but you have to believe it’s possible. And if you believe it’s possible, that orients your mind to start looking for solutions for help. If you believe you’re a victim of disease, which most cancer patients are conditioned into victimhood, and most people are conditioned into victimhood by the medical industry, and they’re told, “Well, you have this chronic condition, you’re never going to heal it. There’s medication for it. Fill in the blank. You’ll have to take this medication for the rest of your life, or you’ll have to do these treatments for the rest of your life and cross your fingers, and it’s going to come back eventually. But we’ll treat you when it comes back.

And there’s nothing you did to contribute to your disease, so don’t feel bad. You don’t need to change your diet. You don’t need to exercise anymore. You don’t need to stop smoking. Well, maybe cut back on alcohol a little bit.” And so, so many cancer patients are given permission to continue to live the life that they were living that had some effect or some impact on their current health. And people don’t want to hear that. “So, you’re saying it’s my fault?” “Maybe.”

Hal Elrod: Yeah. Let me…

Chris Wark: Right. Go ahead.

Hal Elrod: I just want to add because I want to insert where my experience so aligns with what you’re talking about. So, I had watched a documentary called Healing Cancer From The Inside Out like five years before I got cancer. And I went, “Oh, if I ever get cancer, I won’t do chemo. I’m going to…” and it was about really healing with nutrition. And I reached out to two of the best holistic oncologists in America when I got cancer, and they said, “Oh, Hal, your cancer is a very rare, aggressive cancer. There’s actually nothing holistic that will stop it before it kills you. You have one to two weeks to live.” So, I kind of have chemo against my, I was like, “I don’t want to, I was resistant,” for all the reasons that you said.

But this is what you just mentioned about doctors, “Just keep doing what you’re doing.” It was almost to test my oncologist to see if I could trust his knowledge and judgment. I said, “Hey, what part does diet play in my healing?” And I had an answer to that in my mind. He said, “It doesn’t matter as long as you do the chemotherapy.” And then I go down to the hospital cafeteria, and I watch people walking around with their IV towers hooked up to chemo, eating cake, pie, pizza, candy, a soda, and it infuriated me. And so, that was the piece. And then the other piece that I wanted to touch on that you just said is, people, they don’t like being told it’s their fault.

For me, it was the opposite. I go, “What have I done in my life? What about my lifestyle has been unnatural, has been not from the earth, or has been toxic prescription drugs, alcohol, you name it, sugar?” So, for me, it was like, “I want to examine everything that could have contributed that I did.” And my doctor was saying, “It’s not your fault. Nobody knows what causes this, blah, blah, blah.” So, it’s interesting. I just wanted two things there, the nutrition piece, and doctors just saying, “Just keep doing what you’re doing, and it’s not your fault,” because people don’t like hearing that versus going, “No, I’ve got to take complete ownership of my body, my mind, my spirit, and my health.” So, I just wanted to echo what you’re saying from my vantage point, based on my experience of being diagnosed.

Chris Wark: Well, your attitude is perfect. That’s the attitude I wish every cancer patient had is it’s very logical, right? We live in a cause-and-effect world. Something caused this, right? Something caused this. Did I cause it? Maybe. And it’s not to beat you up or make you feel bad or anything. This is what I looked in the mirror and said, “Maybe this is your fault,” to myself. I accepted it. I had a responsibility and a role to play in my life and my health and my future. And we have this similar background, right? We started in Cutco, and we got out there selling. And so, I think that job taught me a lot. And you as well, I’m sure, that like you really are in control of your future and your decisions do matter.

Like, you wrote Miracle Morning. That’s about starting your day off in making these specific decisions to start your day off the best way possible. And like with Cutco, you had to get up and like make phone calls and set appointments to try to sell some cutlery. And if you didn’t make those calls, guess what? You’ve got no appointments. And if you got no appointments, you have no sales. And so, like I understood that not just from that job, but in general, like we live in a cause-and-effect world. Something caused this. And if I played a role, I want to know what I can change in my life for the better. Because if I contributed to my sickness, maybe I can contribute to my health, to my healing, to my wellness.

So, I was starting to kind of get my head around that. And again, this all falls under that beat cancer mindset umbrella. But doctors do victimize patients, and they basically tell them, “Nothing you did contributed to your situation, and there’s nothing you can do to help yourself. Just show up for treatment.”

Hal Elrod: That’s it.

Chris Wark: Right? That’s the message you got.

Hal Elrod: “Give all your power to us. It’s up to us. You have no…” Yeah. I mean, versus…

Chris Wark: Yeah. “We’re your only hope.”

Hal Elrod: Yeah. That’s it.

Chris Wark: Right. “We’re your only hope.” And so, the patient is, it’s a weird sort of thing that happens to them psychologically. They’re victimized. They don’t realize it. They’re victimized, they’re disempowered, and then they’re encouraged, like their attitude, their lifestyle choices, their entire life behaviors are reinforced by victimhood. They’re just told, “Well, my doctor said I don’t have to change my diet.”

Hal Elrod: Yeah. And they, “And I love my doctor because he told me that,” right?

Chris Wark: Yeah. “I’ve got the best doctor. He makes me feel so good about myself and my choice.”

Hal Elrod: “None of this is my fault. I get to drinking my diet sodas. I love my doctor.”

Chris Wark: Yeah. And, man, we laugh about it, but it really is tragic. It’s really tragic what the psychology behind that, if you really go deep on it. And we deal with that in our community all the time. Every day, we’re trying to break people out of this victimhood and encourage them and help them understand like your choices matter. And whether you do chemo or not, or you do surgery or not, it doesn’t matter. You can do everything the doctor tells you to do, but you need to understand there’s so much more you can do to help yourself, that you’re not a powerless victim and that the choices that you make on what you put in your mouth, on the way you think, on the way you act and react, your relationships with others, your relationship with God, choosing to forgive, these are all things that you have power to do and changes you can make for the better in your life.

And guess what? They all have an impact on your survival, all of them together. It’s not just one thing, right? They all work together for your good. And so, why not maximize the effort that you’re making to help yourself survive? And so, that’s what we teach, right? Like, we’re not anti-chemo. When I say we, just like me and my team. Like, we’re not anti-chemo. We don’t tell people do it, don’t do it. I chose not to do it. And I know that the Lord led me down that path. because that was the best for me. And you know what’s crazy? I found out years later. I had a follow-up appointment with an oncologist. This is like around 20 years later.

And he said, “Yeah, you didn’t do chemo back then.” And he said, “Based on your age and your cancer type, and you have this genetic driver, it’s called Lynch,” he said, “The chemo wouldn’t have helped you.”

Hal Elrod: Interesting. Would’ve hurt you but not helped you.

Chris Wark: Yeah. It would’ve hurt me. It would not have helped me. And so, that was incredibly validating. And the research had come out at the time, the research had not been fully flushed out, but now 20 years later, they know, “Yeah, no, if you got this type,” the type I had, “chemo have little to no benefit and it’s super toxic and poisonous and could kill you or just make you suffer or make the cancer more aggressive.” So, I’m just so thankful that the Lord led me down that path because that was the best path for me. But regardless, we just love and support everybody that if they have cancer or if they have a chronic health condition, and they want to learn how to help themselves heal, instead of conventional treatment or alongside conventional treatment, like, “We’re here for you. Like, that’s what we’re here to do.”

So, anyway, I’m jumping ahead to my mission now, but back then, it’s like I didn’t have a mission or a vision or anything. I just wanted to live. I wanted to live, and I wanted to thrive, and I ended up getting in this. Once I got into the natural health world, I realized like, “Man, these people talk about disease and cancer so differently.” They’re talking about it being a blessing. They’re talking about thriving through cancer, not just surviving. And there was so much hope and encouragement and just positivity. And then I looked at the conventional side, and it was just doom and gloom and suffering, and people wallowing in self-pity. And it was a lot of false hope.

Hal Elrod: Yeah.

Chris Wark: And patient is being told like, this drug is very effective for your type of cancer. And the patient, here’s the word effective, and they think, oh, that means cure and effective. And I go, there’s four chapters in my book that really are an expose on the conventional medicine and the cancer treatment industry, just so the reader can hopefully avoid some of these perils and pitfalls and make the best decision for them.

But one of those, yeah, sort of, it’s subversive psychology of cancer patient dialogue with the doctor is this language saying this drug combination is effective. Patient thinks effective means cure. And effective doesn’t mean cure. Effective means tumor shrinkage, probable tumor shrinkage, no guarantee. But there’s been studies, there’s been research, and they got the drug approved that allegedly, they proved it could shrink tumors and for some period of time, and so now it’s considered “effective.”

And nobody wants that, right? Cancer patients don’t want tumor shrinkage. They want to get well. They don’t want temporary tumor shrinkage. They want to heal. And so, I created a free guide. It’s called 20 Questions for Your Oncologist. And you can find, you can download this. There’s a link to it on every page of my website. If you go to ChrisBeatCancer.com, you’ll see a link to it. Download it. It’s 20 questions. There’s an audio sort of program like me teaching. There’s a downloadable guide that you can use. Go to the doctor’s, go to oncologist’s office and ask as many of these questions as are applicable to your situation, because the big problem is cancer patients, they don’t know what to ask, and they just get in there and they’re in shock from the diagnosis. They’re totally traumatized. They’re frozen. They’re paralyzed with fear.

And they’re just in there in this sort of stupor and they’re just being told, here’s what we’re going to do, right? You’re going to get chemo, you’re going to have surgery, you’re going to start radiation. We’re going to do this, that, and the other to you. And they just kind of go, okay, right? But if you come in armed with good questions, then you really get the truth. Is this a couple of them? Just for example, will this treatment cure me? Yes or no? I mean, you’d be shocked at how many cancer patients don’t even ask that, right? That seems like an obvious question, but they don’t.

Will this cure me? Yes or no? Whoa, watch out. Doctors don’t like that. They get real uncomfortable quick when you ask them that. They’ll, well, we don’t know. We can’t really say for sure. Sometimes they’ll say no. Sometimes you’ll just get a hard no, it won’t, this will not carry you, but we’re hoping it’ll buy you some time, right? And you need to kind of have the Band-Aid ripped off, like you need to know what you’re dealing with. You’re much better off knowing that a treatment is not going to cure you than hoping it will when it won’t, right? That’s the false hope.

There was a study, I talk about this in the book too, but– and then we’ll move on. I don’t want to turn this into a giant cancer industry conspiracy interview. But there was a study where they interviewed late-stage cancer patients and they asked them, “Do you think the treatment that you’re getting is likely to cure you?” And over 70% of them said yes. Then they interviewed their oncologists and said, 70% of these patients who are terminal cancer patients believe that the treatments are likely to cure them. When they are not, they were getting palliative chemo instead of curative chemo.

Curative chemo means you have a cancer that chemo can cure. It is possible. Palliative means, nope, we know it won’t cure you. Just trying to buy you some time. So, then they ask the doctors, how do you account for this discrepancy? Why do 70% of these late-stage cancer patients think they could be cured by treatment? And the doctors, they all sort of had the same answer and that was, well, it’s really uncomfortable for us to tell the truth, right? It’s an uncomfortable conversation to tell them that they’re terminal and that there’s no cure so the doctors just sort of avoid it. I mean that almost feels criminal. You know what I mean? It’s like the lie of omission, right?

So, anyway, that’s what I try to help people do just right off the bat. 20 Questions for Your Oncologist, download the guide, use it, and it will make a huge impact. It will empower you to ask the right questions, to get the information that you need to make the best decision for yourself before you say yes or no to treatment. And it might prompt you to get a second opinion or a third opinion, or look into something that’s more integrative or holistic or a completely different approach, or you might come out of there feeling very confident because your cancer is highly treatable and has a good cure rate, high success rate. There are some that do, especially with immunotherapies now, I mean, the industry is improving incrementally, bit by bit. They are getting better at putting patients into remission, complete remission for years, and hopefully, for decades.

Hal Elrod: Yeah. And I want us to get tactical, but I want to insert one thought here for anybody listening that is scared, whether for themselves or others. My cancer, acute lymphoblastic leukemia, had a 20% to 30% survival rate, right? So, there was a 70% to 80% chance I was going to die. You mentioned the beat cancer mindset. The first component of my mindset was unwavering faith, that it’s possible for me to beat this. And because it is possible, I will align my thoughts, words, actions, physiology, diet, you name it, everything in my power. And because I couldn’t do or because essentially, the best holistic doctor said, you actually have to do this chemo because your cancer is so aggressive, it wasn’t like, oh, okay, I’ll do the chemo and hope it works.

It was, great, that’s one of many things I will do, and this is what led me to you, but I will combine the best of Western medicine, the chemo that they’re going to give me, which is actually poison that will kill me also while it is trying to kill the cancer. I’m going to combine that with the best holistic practices that humanity’s ever discovered. I’m going to relentlessly research and study what are the best practices, and that’s what, again, led me to your website, ChrisBeatCancer.com, but I was doing three coffee enemas a week. I was doing red light therapy. I was doing ozone sauna. I was doing lymphatic massage. I was taking 70 supplements a day, and I was following your big salad and other diet protocols.

Like, so, it wasn’t, I hope the doctor and the treatment works. It’s like, okay, great, that’s one tool in what I’m doing, but it’s 100% my responsibility to heal my body of cancer, not the doctors. In fact, they’re giving me something that will kill me if I don’t do something to detoxify my liver and my body. And when I asked the doctor, by the way, “Hey, doc, how do I detoxify from the chemotherapy?” He goes, “Ah, we have like another drug we can give you that kind of helps do that.” I’m like, so then I just Googled, what are the best ways to detoxify from chemotherapy? And I got milk thistle and coffee enemas and all of these natural ways to detoxify your body.

So, all of that, just to say (a) I beat cancer with a 20% to 30% survival rate. If I did that, whoever’s listening to this, you can too. And I didn’t have the ability really to do all natural as Chris did. So, it was like, okay, but I’m not, just because I can’t do all natural doesn’t mean I’m going to go all the other way. It was, I’m going to use every available tool and strategy in my tool belt. And with that, Chris, I’d love for us to get tactical and practical strategic for people that either, what can they do naturally in terms of their diet, exercise, things like that? And if you want to even mix in there, like, to prevent cancer, because it’s a lot of the same, right? Like, a lot of the things you’re going to eat in your diet to heal yourself from cancer are the same things you want to keep eating so that you don’t get cancer.

Chris Wark: Well, you don’t need me, man. You just tell them what you did.

Hal Elrod: I learned it from you, so I’d rather hear it from the source.

Chris Wark: Yeah, man, it’s just so awesome. I love everything you just said because you took massive action. You took massive action to help yourself, right? And I absolutely believe that because you took massive action, that’s what put you in the 20% to 30% of patients that survive, right? That’s what put you in that class, right? You increased your odds of survival. With all of that, all the decisions you made, all of the effort, the nutrition, the supplements, the mindset, the exercise, the other therapies, all of those things worked, either helped you or didn’t harm you, right? Yeah. They’re either helpful or not harmful.

And again, this is what we encourage every cancer patient to do, just like, man, just get after it. There’s so much you can do to help yourself. Just get going, right? Just start. You can’t do it all in one day. But when you start reading and researching, you just start making these changes and you learn things and like, okay, I can do this. Oh, I can do that too. All right. And you just start to incorporate things in your life and rearrange your schedule and your day in a way that promotes health and healing and you start eliminating the things that hurt you.

So, practically speaking, in terms of prevention and survival, yeah, the advice is basically the same. The survival advice is a little more strict, but for prevention, look, we have to understand that 90% of cancers are not genetic. It might be even more like 95% to 98% are not genetic. So, what’s causing them? Diet, lifestyle, and environment. Okay? Those are the three big factors that are contributing to not just cancer, but many chronic diseases that we suffer from in the US and modern industrialized countries.

Okay, so diet, very simply put, we’re eating too much meat and dairy. We’re eating too much processed food, fast food, and junk food. All right? Our ancestors do not eat that way. Our ancestors, yes, our ancestors ate meat and dairy, but they ate a lot of plant food, a lot of fruits and vegetables, whole grains, nuts and seeds, herbs and spices. And guess what? It was all organic back then.

Hal Elrod: That’s right. There was no roundup.

Chris Wark: There was no roundup, right? There was no diquat or paraquat or atrazine or 2,4-D or glyphosate, like they weren’t spraying all these horrible, toxic chemicals on food. They weren’t using all these weird chemical additives, flavors, colors, preservatives, emulsifiers, texture enhancers in processed, packaged food, and fast food. And so, getting back to a diet that’s focused on eating whole, preferably all organic, mostly organic, whole plant food from the earth that God made for us eating animal protein sparingly, not three times a day. Three times a week is a much better ratio than three times a day. You don’t have to be a strict vegan.

But if you’re trying to heal cancer, we encourage cancer patients to get off all animal protein completely. And there are a number of ways that animal protein can fuel cancer growth. So, it’s just, you want to be on the safe side, get off animal protein. I go way into it into the science and all that in Chris Beat Cancer, the book, if anybody wants to really get into it. I also have an article called the Animal Protein Cancer Connection that’s on my website. So, you can see a lot of the research that explains it. So, that’s the diet part. It’s not complicated. Eat whole food, eat real food, stay away from the processed food, fast food, junk food as much as possible. And that’s a huge shift.

Alcohol, major contributor to cancer. There’s at least 11 different cancers linked to alcohol. Tobacco, most of us have gotten away from tobacco. Cigarettes were the number one cause of cancer for the better part of the 20th century. Smoking was the number one cause. And that’s on the decline. Major, major decline in lung cancer because so many people don’t smoke anymore, right? And so, that’s great. Now, vaping could create a new set of problems. And it’s a little early to know the impact that vaping has on lung cancer or other cancers, but don’t vape. So, what’s that?

Hal Elrod: It’s better safe than sorry on that one.

Chris Wark: Yeah. So, alcohol and tobacco are major contributors, and by the way, moving from diet into lifestyle, right? So, alcohol and tobacco, but also pharmaceuticals. If you watch television, every other ad is a drug ad and listen, listen closely, because at the end of every drug ad, they’re telling you the side effects, not all the side effects, but they’re telling you some of the side effects. And a lot of times, they say, may increase the risk of certain types of cancer. Okay? So, some of your listeners may be taking some prescription drugs that are increasing their risk of cancer. And if you are, I just want to encourage you, look up the drug name and look at the known side effects. Every drug has to have its own dedicated website with the list of side effects and studies done on the drug. And it might be a little scary to find out, but you need to know. It’s better now than later. And so, those are three big contributors – alcohol, tobacco, and pharmaceuticals.

The other lifestyle factors are being sedentary. So, tobacco is the number one cause of cancer. The second leading cause of cancer, this is fun because I can usually stump an audience with this. If I ask an audience, what do you think the second leading cause of cancer is? People throwing out all kinds of guesses and they rarely get it right, but it’s obesity. Obesity is the second leading cause.

And we’re in a culture now where you’re not even allowed to talk about obesity or being overweight, because now you’re accused of fat shaming. And we all should be body positive, even though everyone’s on Ozempic now, then now that’s so easy to lose weight. The body positive movement’s kind of gone out the window, interestingly. It just shows you that it was sort of a big sham.

Hal Elrod: Totally.

Chris Wark: But again, I’m not trying to make anyone who’s overweight feel bad. I just want you to understand that, that obesity is the second leading cause, because when you’re overweight, it’s a burden to your body. And all those extra fat cells are producing hormone imbalances and inflammatory molecules. And when you are overweight or obese, it actually inhibits your immune system. So, it’s proven, you have a reduced immune capacity. They even found, this is just a few years ago, researchers found that immune cells in an obese environment were also obese. The immune cells themselves were clogged up with fatty acids.

Hal Elrod: Oh, wow.

Chris Wark: And they became slow and sluggish and ineffective. And if you think about your immune cells being your army that’s supposed to fight off foreign invaders and cancer cells, do you want an army of overweight, out-of-shape soldiers that are slow and sluggish and lazy, and you know? No, you don’t. And so, that was just an incredibly revelatory discovery in science. It didn’t make major headlines, but of course, the nerdy folks like me saw it and were like, whoa. Like, I got to make a video talking about this.

So, anyway, all that to say, when you eat whole foods, plant foods, and lots of fruits and vegetables, you get full faster, you consume less calories, and weight starts to come off. We just see it. People in our community that jump on a whole food, plant-based diet, they just lose weight.

Hal Elrod: One of the things that made so much sense, because I went raw vegan after my first Tony Robbins event back in 1999, 2000, I think, something like that. And what really opened my eyes was that food, at least if it’s whole raw food, is literal energy. And I remember Tony Robbins had this device on stage and it measured how much energy was being emitted from something and he put it up against a piece of raw broccoli and it was like 2,000 megahertz of energy. And then he put it on cooked broccoli and it was like 200 megahertz. It was like, okay, way less. Then he put it on a steak and it was like 7 megahertz of energy, right?

And so, the idea that like if you’re eating fast food, I don’t know what it measures, but it’s literally not giving your body nor that army of immune cells that you said, it’s not giving them energy. It’s just toxic chemical sludge that’s destroying them. And when you said obesity is the number two cause, what came up for me is like, well, not just because the obesity itself and being overweight potentially and all the effects you talked about and the obese cells. It’s the other things, it’s what you ate that got you that way, right? So, it’s all the toxic food and chemicals and all of that, I would imagine, that also contributes potentially to that being the second leading cause. And I would not have guessed, if I was in your audience, I would’ve thrown out a bunch of stuff.

Cocaine, I don’t know, man, well, hey, I know we’ve got some other things. We’ve got to go into, but ChrisBeatCancer.com. Everybody should go there. Where else should people go to connect with you if anywhere else, follow you? I know you’ve got your book, Chris Beat Cancer, which I’ve read that. I’m going to order Beat Cancer Daily. I have not read that. I’m also going to order Beat Cancer Kitchen. I’m looking over your shoulder. I don’t have that one. Yeah, man.

Chris Wark: That’s great. I think you’ll enjoy them. Beat Cancer Kitchen is a full color cookbook. Beautiful photos, delicious recipes. It’s all plant-based, raw and cooked food. And I want to touch on a couple things before we jump off, just so folks know, you don’t have to be all raw to be healthy, but just eating a variety of raw and cooked food is wonderful. But when you eat raw food, this is what’s so amazing, when you eat a raw apple, you are getting vitamins and minerals, okay? You’re getting enzymes, which are destroyed in cooking. You are getting probiotics, so you’re getting live bacteria, good bacteria. You don’t have to take a supplement. You just need to eat raw fruits and vegetables. One apple has about a hundred million bacteria in it.

Hal Elrod: Wow.

Chris Wark: A hundred million. And you got to eat the core though, because a lot of it’s in the core.

Hal Elrod: Oh, okay.

Chris Wark: Yeah, that’s a little fun fact, but…

Hal Elrod: How do you do that? How do you eat the core? Eat the seed, all of it?

Chris Wark: You just eat it. You just keep eating. Yeah, you just keep biting the apple until you just got…

Hal Elrod: Until there’s that little, yeah, I got it.

Chris Wark: Yeah. Eat all the way around it, and then I’m like, okay, eat the core, chew it up, it’s fine.

Hal Elrod: You chew the seeds as well?

Chris Wark: Yeah.

Hal Elrod: Oh, amazing. I can’t wait for my next apple, man. I’m going all in.

Chris Wark: Eat it. Yeah, core seeds and everything. But every fruit, every vegetable has these wonderful good bacteria, and then they also have fiber, which we know is prebiotics. So, that fiber makes its way into your gut and feeds more good bacteria, different strains of good bacteria that you need in your gut that help protect you and are a key part of your immune system.

Then you’re also getting water when you eat raw food, because it typically dries out when it’s cooked. It’s not as water rich. So, you’re getting all these incredible benefits just from eating some fresh fruit and a big salad. So, I mean, that to me is like so exciting. What I try to do is I try not to– I feel like a scare tactic. I mean, I could certainly talk all day about how horrible processed food is and how horrible pesticides are and scare people and try to scare them away from eating that way. But that’s part of the conversation that’s important. But to me, I get more excited about talking about like just all the incredible benefits that you get from choosing healthy food, whole foods, fruits and vegetables, nuts and seeds, herbs and spices, whole grains, legumes. I’d rather encourage you and get you excited about eating that way than try to scare you into eating that way, if that makes sense.

Hal Elrod: Totally.

Chris Wark: And then, so anyway, the last thing I do want to say before we jump is that I talk about this a lot in my Chris Beat Cancer and in Beat Cancer Daily, but just the power of forgiveness.

Hal Elrod: That you’ve mentioned at the time, I’m curious.

Chris Wark: It’s just so huge, man. Anger and bitterness and resentment are toxic emotions, and they’re not just thoughts or feelings that are in between your ears. These emotions affect your whole body, right? Like, fear is an emotion. We all know, like when you’re afraid, you start sweating, you’re shaking, it’s a full head-to-toe body response, right? And so, anger and bitterness and resentment have that effect on your body. And when you hold onto the hurts from your past, and we’ve all been hurt by people, we’ve all been hurt, we’ve all been betrayed, we’ve all been insulted, we’ve been let down, we’ve been abandoned, we’ve been abused. Like, we’ve all been hurt by people. And when you hold onto that hurt over time, the longer you hold onto it, the more damage it does.

And every cancer patient I’ve ever talked to, I mean, pretty much had people in their life they needed to forgive. And forgiveness releases you from a prison of pain. That’s the big thing. If you’re in pain from people who’ve hurt you and you’re struggling and you don’t want to forgive because they don’t deserve it, and you’re right, they don’t, but the only way to get yourself out of that prison of pain is to forgive and to give it to God. And so, I just want to end our interview with just this encouragement, and this is what I did. I’m not telling you to do anything I haven’t done. I made a decision to forgive every single person who had ever hurt me until there was no one left.

Hal Elrod: Love that.

Chris Wark: Right? Until there’s just no one, like I have racked my brain, I’ve thought through my life over and over and over, every season, every age, every situation, right, I’ve forgiven every person who ever hurt me. Little, tiny, just insults to big things, all of them. And I just give it to God and I say, “God, I forgive them.” By the way, forgiveness is a choice. It’s not a feeling, right? I made the choice to forgive. And the way you make the choice is very simple.

I’m just going to give you the forgiveness prayer, and y’all can use it. It’s free. Okay, it’s a freebie. You just say, “God, you know what they did and you know how I feel about it,” right? You’re thinking about something someone did. And it’s okay to acknowledge like, I don’t want to forgive, right? I don’t want to forgive them, but I’m choosing to forgive. I’m choosing to right now, and I’m giving it to you. I’m just letting it go. They’re all yours, right? You can execute justice and judgment and whatever, like I’m just releasing all of that. And I’m not going to carry it anymore, right? I’m just letting it go. They’re all yours. That’s what forgiveness is. It’s a decision.

And if you really want to take it, kick it up a notch, then you ask God to bless them, right? You do what Jesus said, which is love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you. That’s hard, but you can do it, right? And so, I’ll just say, “God, I would rather you didn’t, but I’m asking you to bless this person who hurt me.”

Hal Elrod: If you could bless them and inconvenience them a little bit for me, that would be…

Chris Wark: Yeah, I’d love to see them trip and fall on their face, or maybe get struck by lightning, whatever you can muster up, I’d love that. But God knows your heart. You don’t have to fake it, right? You don’t have to pretend that you don’t want to forgive. You don’t have to pretend that you don’t want them to be blessed. He knows you don’t. But when you humble yourself and say, “God, I’m going to forgive anyway, because even though I don’t want to, and God, I’m asking you to bless them, even though I don’t want you to,” I’m telling you, this will transform your heart. Like it will heal your heart in a way that nothing else will. And I’ve done it so many times. I am a satisfied customer, my friend, of forgiveness.

And I’ve learned how to be quick to forgive when people hurt me, because people still do. I’m on the internet, man. People are mean to me all the time, right? People let me down. They hurt me. They insult me. I’ve had more vicious attacks since I became an internet personality or whatever than I ever did before while I had cancer. But yeah, I’ve just learned to be quick to forgive. So, that’s the other part of it, right? You forgive everybody who’s hurt you. You just work through that, work through your own personal history of hurts and pain. Work through it. You can’t do it all in one sitting. It’s okay. Just take your time. Work through it each day or a few times a week, just like sit down and just say, okay, who do I need to forgive today, God?

And then be quick to forgive when things happen, right? Just don’t let anyone steal your joy, because people will, right? Anger and bitterness and resentment. What’s that?

Hal Elrod: If you let them, they will steal your joy.

Chris Wark: If you let them.

Hal Elrod: They can’t steal your joy if you go, “Hey, you’re a human, you make mistakes. I love you. I forgive you. I get it. I bless you.” Like that for me is, no matter what anyone does, I realize we all make mistakes. And forgiveness is, like, everything you’re saying is, this is about you. You’re not calling them being like, hey, you said nothing about communicating forgiveness to the other person. It’s literally just letting it go inside of yourself, right?

Chris Wark: That’s right. You don’t have to talk to them. They don’t have to know. They don’t have to be alive, right? They don’t have to be living. You don’t have to talk. Don’t have to hang out. Don’t have to be friends, right? This is between you and the Lord, between you and God. And one other little thing I want to leave your audience with that’s so powerful is gratitude because this goes along with this conversation. Stress is a major contributor to cancer, right? And bitterness and anger and unforgiveness produce stress.

And the other thing that is so powerful for me that I found was that when I’m distressed, when I’m fearful, when I’m unhappy, when I’m frustrated, I can snap out of it pretty quickly if I just practice a little gratitude. That’s the secret. And the way I practice it is, let’s just say something goes wrong, right? Something goes wrong. I’m pissed off about it. I’m irritated, whatever. And I’ll feel those feelings. It’ll start to just come on me. You know how it does, right? The emotion just starts welling up and you’re just like, oh, man.

And so, on my best days and my best moments, I’ll catch myself and just go, all right. All right, this stinks, but what’s good in my life? What’s good? I’ve got a wife who loves me. I have two beautiful daughters that are doing great and they’re healthy, and we’ve got a home and we’ve got enough money to pay our bills, and we have wonderful friends and family, and I’ve got these two great pets that I love, got the best dog and cat in America. And all of a sudden, like, I’m already feeling better. You know what I’m saying? Like, I have so much good in my life to be thankful for and it outweighs the bad, a thousand to one. And if I just stop and just count my blessings, take stock in, what do I have that’s good, man, it just shifts me right out of that bad attitude so quick. And my gratitude hack is this one sentence. Right now, there’s someone dying in the hospital that would love to trade places with you.

Hal Elrod: Wow.

Chris Wark: Right? It’s true, right? They would love your problem, I promise you. There’s someone in the hospital that would trade places with you right now if they could. And they’d take your problem over their problem because it’s their last day. So, if you can remember that, if you can give yourself that little pep talk, man, that’ll slap you around a little bit. You know what I mean?

Hal Elrod: That’s an immediate perspective shift. Well, Chris, dude, speaking of gratitude, huge gratitude from me to you, man, for the work you do in the world, but personally, in my life, you were– I don’t know that there was anyone. I read lots of books and all, lots of things like you were the primary person who was guiding me without knowing it through my holistic side of my cancer journey, which I believe is why I am here today. And so, I cannot thank you enough for the rest of my life. I love you. I appreciate you. Thank you so much for all you’ve done for me and so many people, brother.

Chris Wark: Well, Hal, I love you. I love your story. I’m so glad to be a part of it. Like, what an awesome privilege, like you made my day for sure. I really didn’t know how much, I mean, obviously, we had a phone call, but I really didn’t. You just never know what kind of impact do you have on somebody else. And you know this too, you put books out there to help people and you have no idea what kind of an impact you’re making on someone. And when you find out it was a big impact, man, it’s like the best feeling ever.

Hal Elrod: Totally.

Chris Wark: And so, I’m just thrilled to know that. And thank you so much for having me on your podcast and helping me, hopefully encourage some of your folks, some of your audience, folks in your world and, yeah, good to reminisce on Cutco.

Hal Elrod: Yeah. It’s funny, I was just thinking about it. I’m like, we have so much in common. We were in Cutco, we beat cancer. Our background is all of the books we’ve written.

Chris Wark: Yes, that’s right.

Hal Elrod: We’re all clean shaven now. Yeah, so anyway…

Chris Wark: I’m not. And pretty close in age. I’ll be 49 this year.

Hal Elrod: Oh, I’m 46. Dude, you look younger than I do, man. Whatever everybody said, guys, the one benefit we didn’t even talk about is eat all the things Chris said, do the things Chris said. Practice forgiveness and gratitude, and you will look as young as Chris Wark looks at 49.

Chris Wark: I’m just caked in makeup right now, man.

Hal Elrod: I love it.

Chris Wark: Not really. No makeup. This is it. This is a no makeup situation, I promise, folks, but it really is the food, right? It’s the diet and the lifestyle and exercise, all that stuff. It keeps you young. We’re all going to age, we’re all going to get older, but you really can slow down aging with your choices. It really does make an impact. So, anyway, man, we could talk for hours and hours. It’s just been so much fun.

Hal Elrod: You too, brother. All right, man, well, goal achievers, anybody listening to this, go to ChrisBeatCancer.com. Grab the book, Chris Beat Cancer, as well as his other titles. Follow him on Instagram. I’m telling you, he will impact your life in a positive, maybe even life-saving way like you did for me.

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